A Tale of Three Churches

Disclaimer: In calling this presentation A Tale of Three Churches, the term church as used here denotes that each of these fellowships calls themselves a church. It is not the acknowledgment of all of them as true churches in the biblical sense.

This is the examination of three high profile churches and their approaches to ministry in three key areas—leadership, preaching, and mission/evangelism. All three churches are large in size and globally influential.

The Churches

A church in the land without the Spirit is rather a curse than a blessing. If you have not the Spirit of God, Christian worker, remember that you stand in somebody else's way; you are a fruitless tree standing where a fruitful tree might grow. — Charles Spurgeon

Hillsong Church originated in Sydney Australia and has its roots in the Australian arm of the Assemblies of God denomination (which is Pentecostal). It has now franchised itself to many major cities all over the world including London, Moscow, Capetown, Paris, Amsterdam, and New York.

A major reason that I have included Hillsong as one of the churches to profile is because of my long history interacting with them during my time in Australia, and because they are about to open their latest franchise in our own Los Angeles backyard.

You may have noticed that I am using the term franchise for describing Hillsong's strategy of reproducing themselves around the world. It is not meant to sound derogatory ... no, actually it is meant to sound derogatory. I should be up front from the outset that I am a staunch critic of this organization and as we examine them in the areas of leadership, preaching, and mission/evangelism you will get to see a lot of major reasons for that criticism.

The major thrust of Hillsong's global impact has been their music. Their choruses are sung around the world in multiple languages and produced with world leading musicianship and production values. Their music has been a massive magnet in drawing people from all over the world to their many conferences which are equal in scale to anything that happens in the USA. Their youth band, Hillsong United, had their last album make the top ten on Billboard's secular charts. The music is a very big deal and has provided an enormous platform for the preaching ministries of Brian and Bobbie Houston (yes his wife is a "pastor") as well as their books.

Saddleback Church is a multi-site church with its mother ship located in Orange County, California. Originally affiliated with the Southern Baptist movement, Saddleback has risen to massive global prominence through their pastor Rick Warren who is possibly the world's leading proponent of church growth methodology. Warren's status now goes well beyond the role of pastor and he sees himself as a global statesman and activist in transforming the world. And no, I am not describing another episode of Pinky and the Brain.

Undoubtedly, Saddleback's major catalyst for growth in size and influence has been Warren's phenomenally popular books—The Purpose Driven Life and The Purpose Driven Church. Purpose Driven Life has sold over 32 million copies and is the bestselling non-fiction hardback in history. Did I mention that Purpose Driven Life is the bestselling non-fiction hardback in history? The book essentially is Warren's philosophy for life and has gained widespread acceptance even among business organizations and sporting teams. Warren has now actually placed a patent on the word purpose which is why this presentation has cost me $5.00 thus far (five mentions of the word at $1 apiece).


Grace Community Church in Sun Valley California is the third church we will be looking at in this presentation. It is a suburban church that experienced significant growth through the "Jesus movement" of the sixties and seventies.

Though not as large as Saddleback or Hillsong, GCC is a burgeoning mega-church with a major global impact through it's Master's Seminary, Shepherd's Conferences, and the radio ministry of its pastor John MacArthur. On the modern evangelical landscape, GCC is seen as a stick in the mud church with doctrinal rigidity and an aloofness from the various trends that have swept through churches over recent decades.

The Leadership

I exhort the elders among you ... shepherd the flock of God ... exercising oversight not under compulsion, but voluntarily, according to the will of God; and not for sordid gain, but with eagerness; nor yet as lording it over those allotted to your charge, but proving to be examples to the flock. And when the Chief Shepherd appears, you will receive the unfading crown of glory. — 1 Peter 5:1–4

Leadership: Hillsong Church

The pastor of Hillsong's founding church is Brian Houston. He also oversees all the other Hillsong churches as well as being the National President of the Australian Christian Churches denomination (an amalgamation of Pentecostal and Charismatic churches including those formerly known as the Assemblies of God). He is actually the Senior Pastor of every Hillsong church around the world which must certainly make matters of church discipline and visitations very challenging.

Due to my rather lengthy history of correspondence, investigation, and articles on the Hillsong empire I was not able to ask specific questions regarding their philosophy of leadership and model of church government. While the inner workings cannot be precisely known, due to their high international profile and the mass marketing of their material, a fairly accurate picture can be assembled quite easily.

The pictured book title gives an excellent synopsis of Brian Houston's philosophy of leadership. While he carries the title of senior pastor, he really functions much more as the CEO of a vast organization and marketing machine where mentors his people as a life-coach and motivational speaker. Tony Robbins with some Bible verses for window dressing.

Since his wife Bobbie is his fellow senior pastor it is clear that his philosophy of church leadership is not informed by 1 Timothy 2–3 and Titus 1. Brian is seen very much as the visionary pastor and his staff and congregation are to be zealously protective of that vision. Any criticism is very poorly received. Brian and Bobbie's consuming desire, according to their website bios, is to place value on humanity. Their approach to building the church is very much pragmatic and based upon the various models they have tried and then sticking with the ones that achieve the best numerical results. That is why I used the term franchising earlier. Because there models of success in church growth are the blueprints for every other Hillsong franchise around the world. Listen to Brian long enough and the pragmatism always shines through. He is very slick at not taking sides and not alienating any demographics in what he says. When interviewed on abortion, Houston said:

On the subject of abortion I'm pro-life. But in a way I'm pro-choice as well, because I believe in the sanctity of life and I believe that life begins at conception. But I also believe that ultimately human beings have to make their own choices, and I ultimately can't tell you what you should do.

Attitudes towards money are also an important issue for church leaders as Paul says that those who are elders must not be "a lover of money (1 Timothy 3:3). Although Brian Houston bristles at the suggestion that he is a prosperity preacher, he lays out his financial theology quite clearly in his book titled You Need More Money. In it he encourages us to "become comfortable around money" by "putting on your best clothes and ordering coffee in a fancy restaurant or hotel lobby. Even though you could make the coffee for half the price at home, the total experience may enlarge your thinking. You may even feel better about yourself and life." 

Hillsong is now a very marketable brand and carries a strong allure with it. I can guarantee that outstanding music and musicianship will be an essential part of the new Hillsong that opens soon in Orange County. And the musician's caliber always trumps his character when it comes to selecting the right team. 

Key Quotes:

"I appoint the elders and then the rest of the elders vote on that." — Brian Houston

"When you are doing what is correct in God there is a protection over your life. Like—hello—it is just there. So it is a very powerful thing. Amen. Yeah, fully." — Bobbie Houston

Leadership: Saddleback Church

Saddleback's senior pastor is Rick Warren. I was unable to get any answers regarding Saddleback's leadership philosophy and model of church government. What we do know is that Warren's big picture initiatives do give us a window into his philosophy of ministry.

His approach is very ecumenical when it comes to interfaith dialogue but heavy handed when dealing with Purpose Driven dissenters. Joseph Farah of World Net Daily has pointed out:

While mega-pastor Rick Warren has joined a group of 100 church leaders calling for interfaith dialogue and the building of "common ground" with Muslims, he has a slightly different outlook toward Christians with whom he disagrees. In his latest missive to fellow pastors, he writes: "You've got to protect the unity of your church. If that means getting rid of troublemakers, do it." 

Perhaps this hints at Warren's leadership Modus Operandi. 

Tellingly, Warren had absolutely nothing to say about eldership and church government in an article he wrote on his church leadership website, pastors.com. His article was called Organize Your Church on Purpose and Giftedness. And that is pretty much all he talked about concerning church structure. There was no information I could find on the Saddleback website regarding other pastors or elders. Perhaps the revelation of being complementarian or egalitarian would put a major dent in the breadth of his appeal. Though Warren is seemingly silent on that issue, the fact that women have filled his pulpit during weekend services on a number of occasions shows his hand in that regard.

Concerning how much power he wields on Saddleback's elder board remains a mystery. But time has borne out the reality that those churches who buy into the Purpose Driven program are counseled to remove dissenters or wait for them to leave.

With phenomenal book sales, Rick Warren has become a bankable brand. And he clearly has an army of spin doctors constantly working to purge the internet of criticism as well as contradictory statements he has made. I personally know of people who have had their web servers pressured to remove their websites by Rick Warren's defenders. One individual had his blog shut down. There do seem to be some sacred untouchable cows in what Janet Mefford has referred to as the Evangelical Industrial Complex and Rick Warren certainly looks like one of those protected species. One cannot help but think that he would be difficult to overrule at the eldership level in Saddleback church.

Leadership: Grace Community Church

Grace Community Church is a church ruled by a plurality of forty elders. John MacArthur may be the elder most recognized for his preaching and teaching gift, but that does not translate to veto power at the eldership level. He does not always get his way and neither do any of the other elders. Votes must be unanimous to pass and forty elders means a tremendous safety buffer of checks and balances. it would be near impossible for a pope or dictator to rise up within such a leadership structure. 

John MacArthur has a 45 year track record of leadership informed by Scripture, applied consistently in all spheres of life, and lived by example in the leadership of his family before the members of GCC for all of those years. 1 Timothy 3 and Titus 1 are the filters through which every elder candidate passes. The evidence is overwhelmingly demonstrative of this high view of Scripture. For example, elders with children who apostatize or live in constant rebellion normally step down from eldership both in obedience to 1 Timothy 3:4 and Titus 1:6, and a desire to prioritize the evangelism of their own immediate family. GCC's commitment to male eldership and male preachers again speaks volumes for their unwavering subservience to the dictates of Scripture rather than the whims of the world.

John MacArthur's leadership has also been a bastion of biblically understanding when separation is necessary. MacArthur has four decades of refusing to buy into ecumenism, capitulating to Rome, nor associating with false teachers and apostates. Sadly, MacArthur's sterling example on this front has been emulated by scant few.

Bonus Material:
Book Review — The Master's Plan for the Church by John MacArthur

The Preaching

The preacher's job is to deliver the goods, not to manufacture them. — Dr. Irv Busenitz

Forty Days of Your Best Prayer of Jabez Now — Cameron Buettel

Preaching: Hillsong and Saddleback Church

Probably the most critical question that congregants need to ask about the preaching they sit under concerns whether the text drives the sermon or the sermon drives the text. Hillsong and Saddleback preaching overwhelmingly falls into the latter category. It does not take long for a discerning listener to realize that both of these churches churn out sermon after sermon where a pre-determined idea gets married to a biblical passage deemed as a suitable partner. Furthermore, the suitable text is often ripped wildly from its proper context in order to make that square peg fit in their round hole.

Hillsong have also brazenly displayed their contempt for biblical authority by their willingness to edit Bible verses in accordance with their own agenda. Tragically, they are a sacred cow in Australia and have escaped any public rebuke from any prominent Christian leaders. Their willingness to make Hillsong altered Bible verses for their Hillsong adjusted gospel presentations is nothing short of disgraceful. Their conflicting excuses for doing this would be laughable if they weren't so tragic.

Both Brian Houston and Rick Warren approach the task of preaching from the starting point of their own chosen topic. That is not always a problem, but it is if that is the totality of what they feed their members. An even greater problem is when you start with a patently unbiblical idea. But perhaps the ultimate tragedy is when an essential soteriological truth gets buried beneath the weight of their own agenda. And that is precisely what happened when Brian Houston preached at Rick Warren's church out of 2 Corinthians 7:8–10.

Bonus Material:

A Review of Brian Houston's Sermon at Saddleback Church

Is There No Repentance in the Gospel of John?

Key Quote: 

"The Bible's a big book, and you're never going to get people to have total agreement on that big book." — Brian Houston

Rick Warren has committed the same crimes on numerous occasions. Most of us were shocked when John Piper invited him to be a keynote speaker at the Desiring God conference. What Warren delivered was some shambolic handling of Scripture. Among the many problems was his redefining of repentance in non-lordship terms; Warren described Jesus' words concerning his yoke and his burden as a discussion on felt needs; and also demonstrated that he is the master of the humble boast—a difficult manouvre that can only be performed by those most expert in promoting their own humility: 

(Watch this video from 43:30 to 44:25, warning: video may induce vomiting)

Bonus Material:

Blow by Blow Analysis of Rick Warren's Sermon at Desiring God

John Piper's interview with Rick Warren was also very revealing in a very unrevealing sort of way. We all know Rick Warren is a smart operator. His MO is always to adapt to his audience and Piper is no exception. It is bizarre that Piper recognizes Warren as a pragmatist, and Warren's pragmatism demands that he gives Piper the answers he wants. Trying to understand Warren doctrinally is like shooting at moving goalposts, and yet Piper just doesn't see the pointlessness of this exercise. Warren tells Piper he believes in the doctrines of Grace and then tells an inter-faith forum (made up of Hindus Muslims etc) that he has no interest in seeing them converted but wants to work together with them. He said on national TV that "God's not mad at you, He's mad about you" and then tells Piper his hero is Jonathan Edwards (who preached Sinners in the Hands of an angry God). And then tells Larry King his hero is Ghandi, tells Barack Obama his hero is Martin Luther King, and tells the Catholics his hero is Mother Theresa. The man is a chameleon. Warren told his church he is opposed to homosexual marriage and then denied it on Larry King. He positively commended the President of Syria (in person) for his treatment of Christians and then told Syrian Christian refugees who live in America that he never did such a thing. He can talk to Muslims for an hour without ever mentioning the Lord Jesus Christ and then tell Piper it's his central focus. Warren can tell Piper that penal substitutionary atonement must always be there in Gospel preaching, but I cannot find a single sermon with him talking about it. If I sound upset it is because I am. Warren needs to be taken to task over these inconsistencies and if John Piper will not do it, then who will?

Bonus Material:

Analysis of the John Piper - Rick Warren Interview (Featuring Phil Johnson, Tim Challies, Frank Turk, and Chris Rosebrough) 

Both Hillsong and Saddleback profess submission to the authority of God's Word. But I fail to see how they can possibly do that when they continually preach Scripture as the servant of their own sermonic thrusts.

Preaching: Grace Community Church

John MacArthur's preaching legacy is already well established. Having pastored the same church for 45 years and preaching through the entire New Testament verse by verse, MacArthur is a preacher who has continually been enamored with God's Word. I once heard him say that he does not read the Bible to find a sermon, he reads the Bible to know the mind of Christ. This represents a clear reversal of the approach practiced at both Saddleback and Hillsong. I am convinced that the greatest treasure chest on the world wide web is John MacArthur's entire sermon archive available for free download.

Try downloading a sermon of MacArthur's from the seventies, eighties, nineties, and noughties and you will be struck by the textually driven nature of the preaching. Even the illustrations are overwhelmingly drawn from biblical cross-references. The lack of engagement in cultural matters of that time only serves to give an aura of timelessness and current relevance to the listener. How ironic, that so many in their quest for relevance actually make themselves irrelevant. Mark Driscoll's sermonic illustrations connected with the movie Talladega Nights are only a few years old and already most people have no clue about those illustrations.

MacArthur's suit and the big pulpit he stands behind also speaks volumes regarding his desire to point his people towards God's Word. The large pulpit makes the preacher look smaller and the Bible ever in front of him takes pre-eminence. Though not legalistic about it, MacArthur believes that wearing a suit helps represent the seriousness of the task of handling and proclaiming God's Word.

I generally do not buy the mega-church pastor claims that they are being edgy and contextual and relevant by wearing their street wear or casual clothes. Personally I don't take offense at Rick Warren's Hawaiian shirts, but I think it speaks volumes about his heirarchy of importance when he wears a suit to the White House and jeans in the Lord's house.

It also needs to be said (pause for a moment and check for a log in my own eye) that there is something decidedly lame about middle aged men trying to dress like their teenage sons. Petra tried to do it in the nineties somehow thinking that spandex is a viable fashion option for men in their fifties. Brian Houston works hard on his fitness and likes to wear skinny jeans. Rick Warren sits on a stool in the middle of a vast stadium because he thinks it is a way of connecting with his audience ... and probably because he doesn't fit a pair of skinny jeans. But God's Word endures when our coolness fades into oblivion. There is nothing more relevant than pointing all people away from ourselves and towards its own timeless truths of God and man, sin and death, judgment and eternity. It's why young people who are concerned about those things flock to hear the silver haired man in the suit with his Bible always before him.

Bonus Material:
Book Review — Rediscovering Expository Preaching by John MacArthur and The Master's Seminary Faculty

Missions and Evangelism

Preach always, if necessary use words — Rick Warren

Wash always, if necessary use water — Cameron Buettel

There are only two times you should preach the gospel; in season and out of season — Ray Comfort

Mission/Evangelism: Hillsong Church

An extensive examination of Hillsong's mission endeavors will expose you to a lot of social justice programs. They certainly do many helpful projects both locally and internationally, but they are driven by humanitarian goals rather than adorning the preaching of the gospel. It is also noticeable that their aid projects are not prioritized towards suffering believers, but rather among the community at large where great effort is made to raise their community profile. In fact among the myriad of Hillsong outreaches I was unable to find anything that involved any form of evangelism and witnessing. This stems from two major problems:

1. The evangelism is done during the main church service; and
2. The main church service fails to do any evangelism.

My background is in the AOG movement of Australia and I personally lived through the rise of Hillsong to where it has become the overwhelmingly dominant force in Australian charismaticism and evangelicalism. During that time I have personally challenged them repeatedly over the discrepancies between their doctrine statement and what they preach. The most glaring example is their doctrine statement which has always insisted on repentance as a necessary part of conversion and yet I have never heard repentance preached from any of their preachers or articles in more than two decades. In January 2010, after being affronted once more with their false gospel and continually obstructed and ignored by their leadership, I went public and called them out (see also bonus material below).

The gospel that is preached would best be described as a hybrid word-faith message of success, sensuality, and self-esteem. There is no preaching of God's character, man's depravity, the danger of judgment, Christ's person and work, and the call on all men everywhere to repent and believe the gospel.

Key Quote: 
"Doctrine Statement, Shmoctrine Statement!" — Cameron Buettel

Bonus Material: 
My recent interview on Worldview Weekend Radio concerning the gospel according to Hillsong
My entire correspondence with Hillsong's chief theologian, Ps. Robert Fergusson
My online discussion with Hillsong's Executive Pastor, Ps. Joel A'Bell



Mission/Evangelism: Saddleback Church

The only global mission work being promoted on the Saddleback website is Rick Warren's PEACE plan. Here is their own description:

The vision of the PEACE PLAN is to mobilize Christians around the world to address five GIANT PROBLEMS:

Spiritual Emptiness
Self-Serving Leadership
Poverty
Disease
Illiteracy

The Christian Church was designed by God to take the lead in this effort. It has the world's largest distribution network, the most people ready and to serve, and the greatest motivation of all—the LOVE of Jesus Christ. Since responding to these five global giants through the local church is what Jesus says Christians must do, that’s where the PEACE Plan focuses. We have committed ourselves to fulfilling these five expressions of God’s love:

Promote Reconciliation
Equip Servant leaders
Assist The Poor
Care For The Sick
Educate The Next Generation

That sounds more like a UN charter than an evangelism strategy. To quote from the Saddleback website:

The bottom line is that we intend to reinvent mission strategy in the 21st century. This will be a new Reformation. The First Reformation returned us to the message of the original church. It was a reformation of doctrine - what the church BELIEVES. This Second Reformation will return us to the mission of the original church. It will be a reformation of purpose- what the church DOES in the world.

Attention Pastor Warren - why not try preaching that "message" that the first reformers recovered before we even start talking about doing anything. This "second reformation" Warren is fantasizing about only reflects poorly on his understanding of the biblical Gospel and the nature of true conversion. The heart of the human problem is the problem of the human heart, not purpose driven education. 

Warren's second reformation mantra of "deeds not creeds" is a giant red flag. He really believes that the church has got its doctrine right but are not living in accordance with it. Michael Horton, however, would beg to differ. In reality, the problem is the exact opposite of Warren's assessment—he is actually preaching the wrong doctrines and they are living it.

Rick Warren's massive selling book, The Purpose Driven Life, has some major weaknesses. These include the use of many different, and sometimes bizarre, Bible translations to somehow give a Scriptural rationale for Warren's agenda. He also fails to differentiate between believers and unbelievers when applying biblical promises. But worst of all, his gospel presentation is just a complete crash and burn: 

Bonus Material:

John MacArthur explains what is wrong with The Purpose Driven Life ...

It may be politically incorrect but it needs to be said—Rick Warren is an epic failure as an evangelist. I cannot see any good reason why I should believe that most of Saddleback's tens of thousands of members are truly regenerate.


Mission/Evangelism: Grace Community Church

The gospel permeates every arm of GCC's mission arms. Rather than their social work being the heartbeat of their mission program, it is the kindness that accompanies their gospel preaching. Whether door to door in the local area, the annual Christmas concert, or their foreign missionaries and seminaries, all of these are done for the express purpose of reaching out to hell-bound people with the message of eternal life. John Pipers article below explains why true societal transformation only happens as an indirect byproduct of missionaries who evangelize rather than a team of social workers.

Bonus Material:
Missions: Rescuing from Hell and Renewing the World by John Piper


Conclusion

The differences are stark between GCC and Hillsong/Saddleback. Am I biased? I am very biased towards biblical alignment and GCC has that in spades. I am not foolish enough to believe that I can put an end to the violence done to the gospel by churches like Hillsong and Saddleback. But I do believe that we should make a concerted effort to pressure these churches into either conforming their teaching to their doctrine statements or conforming their doctrine statements to their teaching. It is time to put their cards on the table.

Bonus Material:
My recent interview on Tony Miano's radio show — When Doctrine Statements are Used to Deceive




Bonus Material:
You Might Be a False Teacher If ...

Hillsong Pastor Brian Houston's Continual Abuse Of Scripture

Brian Houston, senior pastor of Hillsong Church in Australia (and it's rapidly expanding global empire) has just visited Saddleback Church in California which is just a couple of hours down the road from my current address. I became immediately interested when I found out that Houston would be preaching from 2 Corinthians 7:8-10. I had to ask myself how Brian Houston would preach from a passage explicitly about repentance:

For even if I made you grieve with my letter, I do not regret it - though I did regret it, for I see that that letter grieved you, though only for a while. As it is, I rejoice, not because you were grieved, but because you were grieved into repenting. For you felt a godly grief, so that you suffered no loss through us. For godly grief produces a repentance that leads to salvation without regret, whereas worldly grief produces death. (2 Corinthians 7:8-10).

Those who know me or are regular readers here know of the years I have spent pursuing Hillsong Church and its leaders over their relentless failure to preach the core salvation doctrine of repentance. Not only is this doctrine historically recognized as the necessary corresponding reality of true saving faith, it is also a core element of Hillsong Church's very own doctrine statement (which is somewhat difficult to find, although this may be due to my severe lack of nerd capabilities). To quote from their "What We Believe" page:

We believe that in order to receive forgiveness and the 'new birth' we must repent of our sins, believe in the Lord Jesus Christ, and submit to His will for our lives.

Time and time again I have cited example after example of this violation of their own doctrine statement (several of the videos previously cited have since been removed). In fact, of the services I and others have attended, the books we have read, the CDs we have heard, and the videos we have downloaded or streamed, none of us have ever heard anything about repentance coming from any Hillsong source. Even if it has been preached on an occasion that I am not aware of (and I gave an open invitation to my many critics to prove me wrong with nothing ever forthcoming), such a core doctrine essential to salvation should be strongly evident in all their outreach arms. Hillsong even had the audacity to edit the Bible verse on the back cover of their "Mighty to Save" CD to sanitize repentance out of it (yes, they REMOVED the line from 2 Chronicles 7:14 that says "turn from their wicked ways"). Can anybody else smell a rat?

Fast forward to Pastor Brian Houston's sermon at Saddleback. I polled several friends and colleagues of mine at the Master's Seminary (where I am a student) and asked them if they thought it was possible to preach a sermon out of 2 Corinthians 7:8-10 without mentioning the word repentance. None of them thought this to be possible but Brian Houston proved them all wrong. That's right, he preached directly out of a passage that explicitly and obviously centers on repentance without even once talking about it. How did he get out of even mentioning repentance when reading the text itself? By switching to a very liberal translation (The Message) when he got to verse 9! Preachers are called to submit to the biblical text, not submit the biblical text to their own agenda. If you don't believe me then you can see it for yourself (the translation switch happens at the 15:30 mark). Chris Rosebrough's brutal review of the sermon can be heard here (start listening to the program at the 93 minute mark).

I cannot put into words my personal grief at seeing Houston butcher and pervert a passage of such immense beauty that describes the godly sorrow over sin that leads to repentance and salvation. Furthermore, he twisted the passage into something completely irrelevant to its obvious meaning from a plain reading. Brian Houston believes that the problems at Corinth were caused by Paul's angry letter and that the Corinthians needed to make the decision to stop being bitter and wounded about it so that their pain would be "only for a while". Earth to Brian! Houston we have a problem! Hello!!!!! Paul's angry letter was written because of the incest (1 Corinthians 5:1), immorality (1 Corinthians 6:12-20), lawsuits between brethren (1 Corinthians 6:1-8), idolatry (1 Corinthians 10:1-14), and turning the communion table into a place of drunkenness and gluttony (1 Corinthians 11:17-22). The Corinthians grieved "only for a while" because Paul's rebuke had brought about deep conviction and saving repentance in their lives. As I watched Houston's sermon I was left wondering if he had even read Paul's letters to the Corinthians. My criticism is not the deep theological insight of a Seminary student. It is the obvious conclusions of anyone who would take the time to read these letters in the same way that they read their own mail. It's just not that difficult . . . unless you are determined to avoid the subject of repentance.

Oh how tragic that a church would pay a lot of money for a man to fly a long way and then obscure the glorious truth that is so obvious to anyone who would read that passage. It is perhaps almost as tragic that Brian Houston's continual avoidance of the subject of repentance makes him oblivious to his own need to repent. And repentance of the unbiblical nonsense he is preaching is the single greatest contribution he could presently make to the Body of Christ.

I Just Visited Hillsong Brisbane

Newtaste just commented on a recent post where I discussed some new information that had come to light regarding Hillsong's removal of a line from a Bible verse. Newtaste said that:

In the past few months, the invitation to accept Jesus and/or the prayer has included saying sorry for sinning, asking Jesus for forgiveness, turning away from sin and the reality of Hell. It is not at every Hillsong service, and it was lacking on Sunday night at Norwest, but the elements were there on Saturday night at Waterloo and have been at Norwest on previous Sunday nights. There has been a noticeable change at Hillsong, noticeable to me anyway.

Cameron, you may well have influenced the change, as it was at the end of a sermon by Joel A'Bell that I first noticed it. Who knows!! But it is probably time for you to move on to another topic.

Newtaste, I have two things to say in response to your comment:

1. I hope you are right, and

2. If you are right, then that information is taking a long time to filter into Hillsong's Brisbane campus.

A couple of weeks ago, my friends Josh Williamson and Heath from Perth decided it would be interesting to check out a Friday night service at Hillsong's Brisbane campus during my tour down under. It was a kind of surreal experience because it was the same place that I studied twelve years ago back in the day when it was Garden City AOG.

One of the first things I noticed was that they had assembled a very impressive rock band for their worship services (disclaimer - my assessment of musical prowess may only be quoted at the risk of your own personal credibility). The music was deafeningly loud and I am still undecided as to whether that is a revelation of their volume or my age (41 at last count).

The crunchy guitars (just trying to sound relevant ok) certainly did little to bury the lack of theological content in the songs as did the smoke machine (smoke machines were cool on Countdown in the 70's - another worthy nominee for my Lame Attempst At Relevance Series). But that was all par for the course as the night progressed. To my surprise the sermon started out surprisingly good with an excellent word study on the Greek word "Skandalon" (where the English word "scandal" comes from). I braced myself to eat my words. But here's the question - if you were to preach a sermon on scandals surrounding the life of Jesus, where would you finish that sermon? I would have thought it to be a no-brainer that it would have to culminate with the greatest scandal of all:

For since, in the wisdom of God, the world did not know God through wisdom, it pleased God through the folly of what we preach to save those who believe. For Jews demand signs and Greeks seek wisdom, but we preach Christ crucified, a stumbling block to Jews and folly to Gentiles (1 Corinthians 1:21-23).

Instead, the sermon that night never ventured such lofty highest. In fact it stayed mired in the realm of moralistic stories until it closed with a tragic attempt at a gospel presentation which featured a denial of God's Sovereignty (perhaps unwitting), no mention of sin, no mention of judgment, no mention of the atoning work of Christ, and drumroll please - no mention of repentance. Newtaste, I see no reason to amend my assessment of the Gospel according to Hillsong.

Josh Williamson did try and speak with the preacher after the service but was rapidly brushed aside. Heath went up into the post service follow up room but nobody spoke to him. Like I said - par for the course!

When Hillsong Spin Doctors Contradict Each Other

Many readers would be aware of my pursuit of answers and accountability for some of the more disgraceful practices going on within the Fort Knox like environment of Hillsong church in Australia (and their many franchises throughout the world). The two major issues I took up with them last year revolved around their "Mighty to Save" CD and were as follows:

1. Their failure to preach repentance in their gospel presentation which was in direct conflict with their own doctrine statement. (http://myhillsong.com/what-we-believe)

2. The fact that they boldly displayed 2 Chronicles 7:14 on the back sleeve of the CD but deleted the line from the verse that says "and turn from their wicked ways".

In today's post I just want to focus on point 2 here regarding the "Hillsong adjusted Bible verse" and the conflicting excuses that have emanated from the Hillsong mothership because some more contradictory information has just come to light as you will read at the end of this post.

Here is what I said concerning this in my initial correspondence with Hillsong Church (you can read the entire post here):

I noticed on the back cover of the CD liner notes a quotation of 2 Chronicles 7:14 which says:

if my people who are called by my name humble themselves, and pray and seek my face then I will hear from heaven and will forgive their sin and heal their land.

By checking in my Bible I found this verse to be incomplete and is missing the words in bold print:

if my people who are called by my name humble themselves, and pray and seek my face and turn from their wicked ways, then I will hear from heaven and will forgive their sin and heal their land.

Can you explain to me why you deleted the line from that verse that speaks specifically about repentance? I hope you agree that it is very serious indeed to add to or delete information from sacred Scripture.

Robert Fergusson, who is Hillsong's theological top dog, wrote back but would not even give a reason for the deleted line from the Bible verse. He dealt with it by just ignoring that particular issue altogether. As an interesting aside, I was informed just last week by a former Hillsong volunteer worker that Robert Fergusson's academic credential is a degree in Zoology which probably explains a lot, including why Brian Houston deemed him the right man to oversee the theological soundness of the Hillsong empire (my correspondence with Robert Fergusson can be read here).

I then took up the issue of the "Hillsong adjusted Bible verse" with Joel A'Bell who is Hillsong's executive pastor in Sydney. This is what he had to say on the subject (pay particular attention to how alarmed he was by this revelation):

I'm sorry that certain sentences were left off some of the creative liners of that album. I can assure you it was not intentional as it is very obvious what we believe.

(My correspondence with Joel A'Bell can be read here).

Glen from New Zealand decided to write and got this response from Paul Aylett who is the customer service manager at Hillsong Music:

Thank you for your email to Hillsong Music.

We at Hillsong also honour the Word of God. Please see this excerpt from our Statement of Belief,

"We believe that the Bible is God's Word. It is accurate, authoritative and applicable to our everyday lives."

The intent was to represent the Scripture within the parameters provided. A close examination of the verse will reveal that the words ‘I will hear’ has also been removed to allow for the verse to meet the allocation available on the jacket.

Please understand our heart in this matter.

When Glen pressed the issue further due to the previous unsatisfactory answer he got this response:

Hi Glen,

Thank you for your reply.

At Hillsong we place the highest importance on Scripture as previously stated, and in no way are we devaluing Scripture.

Once again, thank you for your feedback.

Regards, Paul Aylett

Three questions/comments immediately spring to mind as I read this dialogue:

1. It is true that "The intent was to represent the Scripture within the parameters provided", if by that they mean that they were using an incomplete Bible verse for an incomplete gospel.

2. How exactly does editing Bible verses to meet the requirements of your own "parameters" reflect that "in no way are we devaluing Scripture"? Putting Scripture at the feet of your own agenda is Scripture devaluation of the highest order.

3. Is this correspondence evidence that repentance is not only absent from their gospel presentation, but also absent from the Hillsong culture?

Well, as I am currently visiting Australia, my good friend and open air preacher Josh Williamson informed me that he had also had some correspondence with Hillsong on this very issue after reading my blog. And lo and behold, he received a new excuse that contradicts the other ones thus far. Helen Tam, another customer service manager at Hillsong Music, had this to say:

In regards to the album Insert for Mighty To Save, at the time of print the purpose of the album insert was to emphasize that we need to call out to God, while it was read over and we spent a lot of time making sure details were covered, unfortunately this part was overlooked. The verse  should be complete, however due to this album been widespread it’s become an irreversible error.

So, are there any readers who would like to try and join the dots on this one? One thing I would appreciate is if more people would write to Hillsong and protest their disgraceful behavior.

Hillsong Update - Hillsong Explain Why They Edit Bible Verses

In the latter half of last year I had a running series on Hillsong (pastored by Brian Houston) in which I contended with them over their practice of deleting lines from Bible verses and presenting the gospel in a manner that clearly contradicted their faith statement regarding repentance. The two issues were interconnected because they deleted a line from 2 Chronicles 7:14 (turn from their wicked ways) that spoke of repentance. You can read a good summation of it here or click on the "Hillsong Saga" label under this post and scroll through all the previous posts. It does make for shocking/intriguing reading.

One of the standout features of the series and the correspondence that occurred between both Robert Fergusson (their chief theologian) and Joel A'Bell (executive pastor) was their constant refusal to even engage the issue of the altered Bible verse - they seemed to hope it would go away by ignoring it (which is a great way to demonstrate your theological credentials). Today, I am giving an update on this saga because one of my regular readers (Glen from New Zealand) took the initiative to write to them and ask the same questions - and much to my surprise he actually got an "explanation" from Paul Aylett who is the customer service manager for Hillsong Music Australia - and that is a big organization.

Here is the correspondence with Glen's words in bold and Paul Aylett's words in italics.

To whom it may concern,

It's been brought to my attention that the verse 2 Chronicles 7:14 has been incorrectly quoted on the insert of the Hillsong Live: Mighty to Save CD.

As quoted on the insert, the words (that seem to be most commonly translated to English as): "and turn from their wicked ways" have been removed from the verse. From what I can see, there is a slight gap between the first part of the verse and the second part where the missing words should be.

As a Christian, I take the Bible very seriously. And find the removal of these words grieving. I would like to quote Revelation 22:19 (NIV):

"And if anyone takes words away from this book of prophecy, God will take away from him his share in the tree of life and in the holy city, which are described in this book."

I appreciate that mistakes can happen; but as Hillsong represents the church I would like, at the very least, to have this mistake acknowledged, and all future publishing of the insert to have the missing words added (true to the translation the verse was taken from).

Sincerely, Glen

Paul Aylett then wrote back:

Hi Glen,

Thank you for your email to Hillsong Music.

We at Hillsong also honour the Word of God. Please see this excerpt from our Statement of Belief,

"We believe that the Bible is God's Word. It is accurate, authoritative and applicable to our everyday lives."

The intent was to represent the Scripture within the parameters provided. A close examination of the verse will reveal that the words ‘I will hear’ has also been removed to allow for the verse to meet the allocation available on the jacket.

Please understand our heart in this matter.

Once again, thank you for contacting us, we appreciate your diligence and rigour with the Word of God.

Regards, Paul Aylett

Glen wasn't satisfied (of course) and had another try:

Hi Paul,

Thanks for the prompt reply.

I like the excerpt from the statement of belief you quoted. I agree.

Are you saying that the words were removed from the verse so it would fit on the CD jacket? Is the jacket allocation more important than quoting a Bible verse correctly? There is clearly enough room on the CD jacket for the whole verse.

I honestly don't understand Hillsong's heart in this matter. I don't understand why Hillsong would intentionally remove important words from a Bible verse.

Can you please explain?

Sincerely, Glen

Paul responded and If you read ever so carefully you might spot some hypocrisy - see if you can pick it up:

Hi Glen,

Thank you for your reply.

At Hillsong we place the highest importance on Scripture as previously stated, and in no way are we devaluing Scripture.

Once again, thank you for your feedback.

Regards, Paul Aylett

Three questions/comments immediately spring to mind as I read this dialogue:

1. It is true that "The intent was to represent the Scripture within the parameters provided", if by that they mean that they were using an incomplete Bible verse for an incomplete gospel.

2. How exactly does editing Bible verses to meet the requirements of your own "parameters" reflect that "in no way are we devaluing Scripture"? Putting Scripture at the feet of your own agenda is Scripture devaluation of the highest order.

3. Is this correspondence evidence that repentance is not only absent from their gospel presentation, but also absent from the Hillsong culture?

Please write to Hillsong and voice your protest at this disgraceful behavior - the most disgraceful of which is their refusal to even acknowledge that they have done something wrong . . .

Tom Hanks summed up the problems at Hillsong best when he said those famous words "Houston we have a problem!"

My Online "Discussion" With Hillsong's Executive Pastor (Part 7)

Continuing from my earlier post where I closed with this comment to Joel A'Bell who is the executive pastor of Hillsong:

Joel, all I asked you for last time was to bring forward one audio file of a sound biblical presentation of the gospel that has been preached at Hillsong. It is a sincere question and I will be sincerely happy if you can show one to me. It shouldn't be difficult considering the many thousands of souls that get saved at Hillsong church.

Joel responded with these words:

Cameron, the offer still stands to meet with me over any of the gospel presentations I have delivered. And to all of you, as I have previously offered, I would be happy to sit with you over coffee.

For someone who lives in Denmark, Sydney would be a long commute so I asked Joel if we could speak over Skype. Joel then informed me that it was coffee or nothing. I don't know what this thing is about coffee?? Does he want to put something in my coffee? Anyway, I would like to extend the offer to my Aussie friends to take up Joel's offer to meet over coffee. He is not entirely unreasonable even if he has an unnatural aversion to Skype. Maybe you can plead with him over the Gospel preached at Hillsong. Wouldn't it be awesome if a preacher stood up in Hillsong and preached the biblical Gospel - now that would be a landmark day!

Go Back To Part 6
Go Back To Part 1

I Finally Got Sent A Hillsong Video That Proves They Preach The Gospel . . . NOT!!

To his credit Troy did take up my challenge that no one else has responded to. He went looking for a solid example of someone from Hillsong church preaching the Gospel. I had burdened Troy with the responsibility of substantiating his claim that:

I can assure you that I've been to Hillsong quite a few times and have heard the gospel accurately preached. Yes, including the mention of sin and the cross.

Most readers will be aware that I have a long list of grievances with Hillsong Church in Australia. Unlike the many grievances based on their financial practices, I have focussed on their understanding and proclamation of the Christian Gospel. Among my many grievances has been one that I didn't think even Hillsong defenders would argue with - the necessity to preach repentance (you know, turning away from sin). In fairness to Hillsong it is difficult to preach repentance when you never talk about sin. Why do I think that even Hillsong defenders would not argue against this particular grievance? Because they affirm the necessity of repentance on Hillsong's own doctrine statement which says:

We believe that in order to receive forgiveness and the 'new birth' we must repent of our sins, believe in the Lord Jesus Christ, and submit to His will for our lives.

So let's take a look at the video Troy chose to support his claims and alleviate my fears. Pay close attention to Joel A'Bell's focus on repentance in this video:

The Journey [Discovering Christianity] from Hillsong Church on Vimeo.

Troy, I have to ask why you would use that video to argue against what I have been saying? It actually affirms almost everything I've said. So much missing information I don't know where to begin. Who is this God? Why do I need His forgiveness? What cross? Why did Jesus need to die that I can get this gift? Why do I need this gift? Why don't I deserve it? What is this gift? etc etc

On a purely logical level it creates many more questions than it answers. But once again I'll zero in on one point because it is a part of Hillsong's own doctrine statement. The necessity of repentance from sin in order to receive salvation. Where in this video did Joel speak of our need to repent or turn away from our sinful life. Of course it is difficult for Joel to do this when he never even defines sin.

Come on Troy, I am not being a nit picking monster, this is basic Christianity! Instead of arguing with me over this why don't you challenge the Hillsong leadership over this. The more this gets voiced the better the chance that they might repent and start preaching Christianity - which would be a wonderful blessing to their vast audience.

Message For Troy - Hillsong And The Gospel They Preach

Troy, who has commented previously on this blog, insists that Hillsong do faithfully preach the true biblical Gospel. When pressed to provide some evidence (in response to the mountains of evidence to the contrary) nothing has been forthcoming. Instead Troy asked for some clarification. He wrote:

Hi Cameron,

Would like you to clarify a few things. You said:

"I have heard many sermons by Brian Houston and Hillsong conference guests over the years and I am yet to hear a Gospel presentation that is faithful to what I outlined..."

This is the outline you're referring to:

"At the fundamental level, any Gospel presentation should include these five elements:
1. An explanation of The Holiness of God - His character and nature.
2. An explanation of man's depravity - define and explain sin.
3. The necessity of judgment - heaven and hell are real places where real people go - that God is bound by His character and nature to punish sin.
4. Christ's atoning work and resurrection - that Christ fulfilled the law that sinners break, and took God's wrath on the cross in the place of sinners and that the resurrection verifies God's satisfaction with Christ's payment.
5. The call on all men everywhere to repent of their sin and believe the Gospel."

Do you believe that unless someone is taken through all five of your points they are/will not be saved?

So for example simply saying "Jesus I need you, forgive me for my sin, I give you my life, you are my saviour."

Would someone "be saved" after saying that prayer? Or would God say "pretty close, but not quite..."

What about Romans 10:9:

"If you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved."

Does simply believing in your heart that Jesus is Lord and confessing that God raised Him from the dead, make you saved? That's what it seems to say here.

What if a person is alone and does not have someone to take them through the "five points", but in a moment of desperation cries out to God, and their life is forever changed? I've heard many stories of this type of encounter where someone meets Christ.

What are your thoughts? Is it the "five points" or you're not in, or can you be saved with out being so specific?

Dear Troy, I have never said that it is the Gospel presentation that saves people. It is God Who saves - not a salvation prayer (which is something Pastor Joel doesn't seem to understand). My point to you and Joel has never been that we can get a right formula that will save people. Salvation is a miraculous work of the Holy Spirit where He regenerates an "enemy of God" who is "dead in sin" (Ephesians 2:1) into a "new creature" (2 Corinthians 5:17, Ezekiel 36:25-27, Ezekiel 37:1-10)) who loves Him and trusts in Him for forgiveness of sin and His righteousness. Please read my series called Anatomy of the Gospel.

But God chose the foolishness of preaching (1 Corinthians 1:21) as the means of proclaiming the Gospel and we are responsible to get it right. I never said that people could not get saved at Hillsong nor that there aren't Christians attending (though genuine conversion is never cultivated in a place where the Gospel is never preached). Read Galatians 1:8-9 tells us that it is a damnable offense to preach any other gospel than the one he preached. Leaving my five points aside for a moment Hillsong's preachers violate their own doctrine statement when "presenting the gospel" in their failure to preach repentance (their faith statement says that you must repent of your sin in order to be saved). And when is repentance from sin preached at Hillsong??? It is a disgrace that they have such disregard not only for the clear teaching of Scripture, but also for their own doctrine statement (which is correct on this point). Furthermore, since the cross is about Christ taking the wrath that we deserve in the place of sinners - how can you explain the cross without preaching about God's wrath - when is God's wrath ever preached at Hillsong? How can you preach forgiveness without what you are forgiven of (sin). How can you preach salvation without preaching what you are saved from (damnation). I will stop there but I hope you get the point.

As for Romans 10:9, the belief described there is a repentant belief or faith. Scripture is clear that turning to Christ in faith involves turning away from sin.

When God graciously saved me as a biblically illiterate 20 year old I was certainly incapable of theologically formulating the doctrine of justification. But I clearly understood that I was a sinner with nothing to offer God. I knew that my salvation depended solely on the completed work of Jesus Christ. I clearly understood that my human works played absolutely no part in my redemption. I also clearly understood that my human works (or wickedness) were the main reason that I needed a Savior to rescue me from the damnation that I deserved. The issue is not our ability to formulate the doctrine of justification, it is whether we are trusting Christ's completed work alone, by faith, or trusting any other system that involves even the smallest level of works righteousness. And to consciously teach any view of justification that involves any degree of human achievement is a damnable offense - including the idea that our salvation hinges on a human decision/salvation prayer rather than a miraculous work of God. It is the reason Paul wrote to the church in Galatia.

Likewise, we might not understand all the inner workings of the doctrine of the atonement. But we do need to understand that the cross Jesus died on is what we all deserve. Remember these words:

One of the criminals who were hanged railed at him, saying, "Are you not the Christ? Save yourself and us!" But the other rebuked him, saying, "Do you not fear God, since you are under the same sentence of condemnation? And we indeed justly, for we are receiving the due reward of our deeds; but this man has done nothing wrong." And he said, "Jesus, remember me when you come into your kingdom." And he said to him, "Truly, I say to you, today you will be with me in Paradise." (Luke 23:39-43)

Here we have a criminal who is most likely uneducated and lacking a deep working knowledge of the theology being played out on the cross beside him. But he does know that he is evil and deserves wrath. He does know that Christ is fully righteous. He does know that he has nothing to offer the Lamb of God. He does know that his only hope is to completely humble himself as a wretched sinner and beg the Savior for mercy. And it is to these that God grants pardon!

Thus says the LORD: "Heaven is my throne, and the earth is my footstool; what is the house that you would build for me, and what is the place of my rest? All these things my hand has made, and so all these things came to be, declares the LORD. But this is the one to whom I will look: he who is humble and contrite in spirit and trembles at my word. (Isaiah 66:1-2)

It is here we get to ground zero. In order to be saved we must respond in repentance and faith. And different models of atonement elicit different responses to the Gospel. We don't hear the thief thanking Jesus for identifying with the pain of his human experience. We don't hear the thief calling out as a poor victim of Satan awaiting his rescue. We hear a thief who sees his own enormous guilt. We hear a thief who sees the righteousness of the Son of God. And we hear a thief crying out in genuine repentance, trusting in the One Who was heading for His throne. Jesus did not come to provide therapy for victimized people. He did not come to feel the pain of hurting people. He did not come to coach untrained people. He came to save sinners - even really bad ones like me!

My Online "Discussion" With Hillsong's Executive Pastor (Part 6)

OK, time for more dialogue today from my online discussion with Joel A'Bell who is the executive pastor at Hillsong Church in Sydney. But before I do I should tie up one lose end left over from an earlier post in this series. In Part 4 of this series I asked a question that I failed to answer in Part 5. I apologize for this oversight although I think the answer was pretty obvious from just a casual glance at the text from John 4. It would seem that playing fast and loose with the Word of God is becoming a very disturbing trend and theme in the Hillsong culture. The video excerpt used as a companion to Joel A'Bell's message is taken from a Jesus film which recounts Jesus' encounter with the woman at the well as found in John chapter 4. If you watch the video it is pretty much a word for word re-enactment of the Biblical text . . . except that they spliced out a part! Which part? You guessed it - the part where Jesus exposes the woman's adulterous practices. I will not point the finger directly at Joel A'Bell in this instance as he may well be unaware of the final video product (as it was done at a church that he was visiting). But this disturbing trend serves as a timely reminder that we are called to submit to the Scripture. The Scripture is never to be subservient to the agenda of the guy in the sheep-suit.

Anyway, let's pick up my conversation from where Joel responded to my comments regarding his request for a salvation prayer formula (read here if you want your memory refreshed). Before I post Joel's comments I would also like to give Pastor Joel A'Bell the credit for his willingness to respond to me - thank you very much Pastor Joel for extending me this courtesy. This is what Joel had to say:

Cameron, I agree with your list so I don't understand what the problem is. It should be noted that you couldn't merely say it was the next verse in Gal 1 which was my whole point. You had to study many Scripture to come up with your summary. I proclaim the same gospel you speak of but you say I don't. All over the world this gospel is bearing fruit and growing, just as it has been doing among you since the day you heard it and understood God's grace in all it's truth. Sometimes you have an hour to explain the gospel, other times, only minutes. What matters most is not specific words but people being saved by God's amazing grace.

If there is one thing that drives me nuts it is postmodernism. When you express something that is the polar opposite of what you are trying to refute and the postmodernist seems to think that the two opposing factions are saying the same thing "in different ways". The difficulty here is that instead of contending for his view Joel seems to be trying to blur the lines of distinction by assering that he agrees with me and preaches the same message. I wrote again:

Joel, if you agree with me on the Gospel then please bring me an audio file of a faithful Gospel presentation coming out of Hillsong. I have heard many sermons by Brian Houston and Hillsong conference guests over the years and I am yet to hear a Gospel presentation that is faithful to what I outlined (which you say you agree with). So send me the link or audio file and I will gladly stand corrected. But even if someone gets it right sometimes, that still does not excuse perverting the gospel on other occasions. For example, a failure to talk about sin and repentance is perverting the Gospel.

Joseph De Araujo (who appeared earlier in this series) chimed back into the conversation and said:

Cameron, I'm not sure what your expectation of the 'text book' altar call is. My view is that if someone is convicted by the spirit, comes forward and 'chooses Jesus' then he/she is then closer to salvation and is then also open to all education about the gospel in full. They can accept Jesus and assure their salvation and then choose to be baptised in water. I don't see how it's preaching a different gospel. Printing & publishing the gospel is one thing, that must be correct in full, but giving an altar call for people who want to have a relationship with Christ without giving the full salvation message?

Back to the altar call/salvation prayer formula again. It would seem that is the key they see in regenerating a lost individual who is "dead in sin" (Ephesians 2:1). Joel then got back into the ring to further defend himself:

I agree with gospel points (even though it was missing some) above and yet you continue to accuse. Just listen to any appeal for salvation that I give, which is most weekends. The gospel is preached in Hillsong Church and the thousands of new and longstanding Christians are testimony to that. If you are daring to question the validity of the salvation of thousands of people who came to Christ through the ministry of Hillsong then it is very clear what your intensions are.

Could someone please explain to me why it is that so many Hillsong defenders (as well as Rick Warren defenders and Rob Bell defenders etc. etc.) seem to think that they can prove that they preach the Gospel rightly by saying that they do. I thought we substantiate claims in the real world. I wrote again to Joel:

Joel, all I asked you for last time was to bring forward one audio file of a sound biblical presentation of the gospel that has been preached at Hillsong. It is a sincere question and I will be sincerely happy if you can show one to me. It shouldn't be difficult considering the many thousands of souls that get saved at Hillsong church.

More to come . . .

Go On To Part 7
Go Back To Part 5
Go Back To Part 1

My Online "Discussion" With Hillsong's Executive Pastor (Part 5)

There is more dialogue to come from my "online conversation" with Joel A'Bell who is the Executive Pastor at Hillsong church in Sydney. But while we have been pursuing the subject of Scripture's sacredness and the abominable practice of deleting parts of Bible verses, I had to post the observations of a sister from Canada concerning the Brian Houston "money" video that I posted last Monday. Whilst being dazzled by Brian Houston's vast arsenal of marketing techniques I failed to pay attention to his quotation of Scripture. Watch the following video again and pay particular attention to Brian Houston's Scripture quotation. Is there a problem with it????



Here are the observations that our Canadian friend made about the above video:

As the subtitles pointed out in the video of Brian Houston promoting his book “Money,” it is a major error when he says that the Bible says, “Let the poor say, ‘I am rich.’” Those words felt familiar so I went searching and found two choruses that say exactly that.

What the Lord Has Done in Me by Reuben Morgan / Hillsong Music Australia

Let the weak say, “I am strong.”
Let the poor say, “I am rich.”
Let the blind say, “I can see.”
It’s what the Lord has done for me.

Give Thanks by Henry Smith

Give thanks with a grateful heart
Give thanks to the Holy One
Give thanks because He’s given Jesus Christ His Son
And now let the weak say, “I am strong,”
Let the poor say, “I am rich
Because of what the Lord has done for us.”

Brian Houston says, “The Scriptures say, ‘Let the poor say “I am rich.”’” He is quoting an uninspired line from a chorus, saying it comes from the Bible, and using it to support his wealth and prosperity theology. He is building a house of straw on sand and unfortunately misleading many who assume he knows what the Bible says.

So it would seem that the only problem with Brian Houston's Bible verse is that it isn't in the Bible . . . . oh details, details. So deleting "unHillsong" parts of Scripture is not the only hermeneutical skill on display in the Hillsong empire. Perhaps adding new verses to Scripture is another part of the package. I wonder if Pastor Houston holds to inerrancy with regard to Hillsong choruses?

Am I being sarcastic - yes! Is this mock worthy - yes when it is a world renowned "Bible teacher"! Is there something constructive we can glean from this - yes, go to a church pastored by a man who labors in the text instead of inventing new text. And if you have a pastor who is a 2 Timothy 2:15 man, then thank him passionately for his faithful shepherding and the care of your soul.

Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth. (2 Timothy 2:15)

Go On To Part 6
Go Back To Part 4
Go Back To Part 1

My Online "Discussion" With Hillsong's Executive Pastor (Part 4)

Troy wrote to me yesterday to tell me:

All these "Christian" blogs seem do is talk down about other Christians. Who would want to be a part of this (Christianity) if the people who are supposed to love and accept one another just bring each other down? Let's remember above everything else we're called to LOVE Jesus and LOVE others. And let's not forget John 13:35.

Well Troy, there was unfinished business in my previous series - particularly in regard to Hillsong's disgraceful practice of removing a part of a Bible verse (the repentance part). Can you honestly tell me that you don't have a problem with that? My correspondence with Joel A'Bell brings more light to this story.

Secondly, this blog is just one area of the sum of my labor. It is in this forum alone that I venture into polemic critiques and discussions. Furthermore, I like to think that this blog contains a good blend of a wide variety of subjects with both positive and negative stories.

Thirdly, there you go trying to play the love card. Scripture defines God's love in Romans 5:8 . . .

God shows his love for us in that while we were still sinners, Christ died for us.

So if you want to criticize about love then criticize Hillsong for their failure to preach God's love by never talking about sin or the cross (as is ably demonstrated in their CD gospel presentation and the video from my Sep 20 2010 post). Also Troy, if you love God and treasure His word then where is your outrage over Hillsong's willingness to mess with Scripture? I would contend that I am doing this out of love for the truth, a love for God's people who are being deceived, and a love for the true Gospel that God delivered.

But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach to you a gospel contrary to the one we preached to you, let him be accursed. As we have said before, so now I say again: If anyone is preaching to you a gospel contrary to the one you received, let him be accursed. (Galatians 1:8-9)

Now I beseech you, brethren, mark them which cause divisions and offences contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned; and avoid them. (Romans 16:17)

Troy wrote again after these comments:

I really do care about all those things you're talking about. And I can assure you that I've been to Hillsong quite a few times and have heard the gospel accurately preached. Yes, including the mention of sin and the cross.

I think that you are right to question the "tampering" or scripture. But at the same time, I think you keep harping on something that could very well have been an accident that was overlooked, as Robert Fergusson stated in your post. But for some reason you have chosen to believe that this was intentional. I believe that this was not intentional. Unless you have seen them consistently changing scripture, then I see no reason to believe that they do not preach "the true gospel". Especially when like I said above, I have heard it for myself.

Hillsong Church is doing many incredible things around the world in the name of Jesus and many lives are being changed. This is a fact.

Troy, for months now I have been waiting for one solitary example of a faithful Gospel presentation from anything at Hillsong (video, audio, or written). Nothing has been forthcoming - except for several people trying to reassure me that they do preach the Gospel. I do however have an abundance of examples of them preaching a false gospel so bad even their doctrine statement defines it as heretical. So Troy send me the one example of a faithful Gospel presentation that talks about God's holiness, man's sin, judgment, atonement and resurrection, repentance and faith. I am eagerly awaiting . . .

I welcome anyone willing to send me one example they can find and i promise I will give it a fair hearing. I'm waiting . . .

I did go looking for one of these Gospel presentations (of Joel A'Bell) myself in the last few days but did not find anything. But I did find this video featuring Joel A'Bell (and some other guy later on) which was interesting. Joel may not be responsible for the editing but the video excerpt follows the disturbing trend of deleting unsavory parts of the biblical text. Pay particular attention to the portion of video depicting the story of Jesus and the woman at the well (John 4). Watch that part and see if you can spot which part of the dialogue between Jesus and the woman ended up on the "cutting room floor" . . .



Go On To Part 5
Go Back To Part 3
Go Back To Part 1