Wednesday, November 23, 2011

Newsflash! - Evolution Debate (Part 10)

Religious evolutionary fanatics like Kristoffer Haldrup insist that there is absolutely no evidence for the global flood of Noah. Not a single scrap of evidence. The following article here (published just two days ago) is another great example (in the long line of examples) of why evolutionary scientists say there is no evidence . . . because they start with the presupposition that there is no evidence and that their theory must be right - therefore they impose their theory on the evidence and come up with their own set of fabricated facts.

Is it just possible that this recent discovery of a massive whale graveyard high up and a long way from the ocean could be evidence for the ocean once covering this piece of desert? Is it just possible that the mass of perfectly preserved skeletons (including two adult whales with a juvenile between them) in a small area points to a sudden cataclysmic event? Why aren't they surprised to find that these whales which are "millions of years old" are mainly identical to the whales we find in the water today? Why do they consider the possibility of lagoons high up in the desert, and tsunamis that washed a massive number of whales into one spot on a hill in the desert but not even mention the possibility of a cataclysmic global flood like the Bible says? Answer these questions and then maybe you will have the answer to the question as to why religious evolutionary fanatics desperately cling to their assertions that there is "no evidence for a global flood". Because this discovery screams a ton of consistency with a global flood (my comments in italics).

Posted on November 21, 2011 at 12:35pm by Liz Klimas

SANTIAGO, Chile (The Blaze/AP) — More than 2 million years ago, scores of whales congregating off the Pacific Coast of South America mysteriously met their end. Today, they have emerged again atop a desert hill more than a kilometer (half a mile) from the surf, where researchers have begun to unearth one of the world’s best-preserved graveyards of prehistoric whales.

A paleontologist from the museum prepares a whale fossil at the site where many prehistoric whale fossils were discovered in the Atacama desert near Copiapo, Chile. But how did they get there? That’s the question paleontologists are trying to figure out.

Yes, it's a difficult question, when you are committed to denying the obvious!

Maybe they became disoriented and beached themselves. Maybe they were trapped in a lagoon by a landslide or a storm. Maybe they died there over a period of a few millennia. Somehow they ended up right next to one another, many just meters (yards) apart, entombed as the shallow sea floor was driven upward by geological forces and transformed into the driest place on the planet.

Yes, these are all well thought out scientific theories when you consider how difficult it is to think with your head shoved in that desert sand.

Chilean scientists together with researchers from the Smithsonian Institution are studying how these whales, many of the them the size of buses, wound up in the same corner of the Atacama Desert. “That’s the top question,” said Mario Suarez, director of the Paleontological Museum in the nearby town of Caldera, about 700 kilometers (440 miles) north of Santiago, the Chilean capital.

Pick me, pick me! I can answer that question and save you a whole lot of money in research grants in the process.

Experts say other groups of prehistoric whales have been found together in Peru and Egypt, but the Chilean fossils stand out for their staggering number and beautifully preserved bones. More than 75 whales have been discovered so far — including more than 20 perfectly intact skeletons.

They provide a snapshot of sea life at the time, and even include what might have been a family group: two adult whales with a juvenile between them.

“I think they died more or less at the same time,” said Nicholas Pyenson, curator of fossil marine mammals at the Smithsonian’s National Museum of Natural History. Pyenson and Suarez are jointly leading the research.

How much are they paying you Nicholas to come up with these brilliant observations?

As for why such a great number perished in the same place, Pyenson said: “There are many ways that whales could die, and we’re still testing all those different hypotheses.”

Except the obvious hypothesis where all the evidence points to.

The scientists have yet to publish their findings about the fossil bed and the extensive remains, which began to emerge in June last year during a highway-widening project that is now on hold.

So far, the fossils have been found in a roadside strip the length of two football fields — about 240 meters (260 yards) long and 20 meters (yards) wide.

Pyenson said the spot was once a “lagoon-like environment” and that the whales probably died between 2 million and 7 million years ago.

Yes, no evidence of a global flood but he is absolutely certain that that this piece of desert was once a lagoon. A lagoon with whales just like you find today - not! He even has the technology to date this lagoon to 4.5 million years plus or minus 2.5 million years. Great accuracy there - NOT!

Most of the fossils are baleen whales that measured about 8 meters (25 feet) long, Pyenson said.

The researchers also discovered a sperm whale skeleton and remains of a now-extinct dolphin that had two walrus-like tusks and previously had only turned up in Peru, he said.

“We’re very excited about that,” Pyenson said in a telephone interview. “It is a very bizarre animal.”

Other unusual creatures found elsewhere in the fossil-rich Atacama Desert include an extinct aquatic sloth and a seabird with a 5-meter (17-foot) wingspan, bigger than a condor’s.

Erich Fitzgerald, a vertebrate paleontologist at Museum Victoria in Melbourne, Australia, emailed that the latest find is very significant.

“The fossils are exceptionally well preserved and quite complete — a rare combination in paleontology and one that will likely shed light on many facets of the … ecology and evolution of these extinct species,” Fitzgerald said.

There he goes again imposing his evolutionary presupposition onto the evidence. Great empirical science there Enrich!

He said it’s possible “these fossilized remains may have accumulated over a relatively long period of time.”

Here is that great scientific consensus that shows us how much certainty these scientists have with their theory. One guy says it happened at the same time, the other says it may have happened over a long period of time.

Hans Thewissen, an expert on early whales, agreed. Another scenario, he said, is that the whales might have gathered in a lagoon and then an earthquake or storm could have closed off the outlet to the ocean.

Yes, scientists deal with hard empirical facts, not fanciful theories!

“Subsequently the lagoon dries up and the whales die,” said Thewissen, a professor of anatomy at Northeast Ohio Medical University. He said the accumulation of so many complete skeletons is “a very unusual situation.”

“If this were a lagoon that dried up, you might see signs that ocean water evaporated,” such as crystallized salt and gypsum in the rock, said Thewissen, who is not involved in the research. “On the other hand, if a giant wave or storm flung the whales onto shore, it would also have pushed the ocean floor around, and you would see scour marks in the rocks.”

Dating fossils is complicated, experts said, and it will be very hard to distinguish dates precisely enough to determine whether the whales all died simultaneously.

It is very complicated when they have no idea how to do it.

The researchers have been told to finish their onsite studies so that fossils can be moved out of the path of the widened Pan American Highway, or Route 5, which is Chile’s main north-south road.

Many of the fossils have been transported in plaster coverings to the museum in Caldera. Researchers from Chile’s National Museum of Natural History are also studying the fossils.

Pyenson and his team are working quickly under tents to document the intact skeletons. With funding from the National Geographic Society, the Smithsonian team is using sophisticated photography and laser scanners to capture 3D images of the whales that can later be used to make life-sized models of them.

At least they have entire skeletons to base their models on rather than the massive amount of guesswork involved in creating a life sized "Nebraska Man" from a pig tooth.

Suarez, the paleontologist, had long known about the whale bones just north of Caldera – they could be seen jutting out of the sandstone ridge alongside the highway at the spot known as Cerro Ballena, or Whale Hill. When the road work began last year, the construction company asked him to monitor the job to avoid destroying fossils.

“In the first week, about six or seven whales appeared,” Suarez said. “We realized that it was a truly extraordinary site.”

The Chilean government has declared the site a protected zone, and Pyenson said he hopes a museum will be built to showcase the intact skeletons where they lie, in the same way fossils are displayed at Dinosaur National Monument in Utah and Colorado.

Suarez thinks there are probably fossils of hundreds of whales waiting to be uncovered – enough to keep him working at this one spot for the rest of his life.

“We have a unique opportunity to develop a great scientific project and make a great contribution to science,” he said.

Great contribution to science fiction more like it!

Ok Kristoffer, you can now write in and have a cry about how dumb and unscientific I am.

Go On To Part 11
Go Back To Part 9
Go Back To Part 1


Soldier of Kurios said...

Very interesting!

Kristoffer Haldrup said...

Indeed a highly fascinating find, and again it is fascinating to be provided with a glimpse into the thought processes of a deeply creationist mind:)

It is also interesting to see how you, again, manage to actually highlight how science works in your attempts to discredit it. -Here we have a really interesting new observation, and what do scientists do? -They start to speculate based on previous knowledge, "what do we have here", "how did it get here" and, naturally, there will by different opinions. And how are these different opinions finally settled? Well, as the text illustrates, paleontology is an empirical science and the different claims are settled by observation: do we find gypsum deposits near the fossils or do we find scour marks in the rocks? -Clues such as these (and many, many other) will tell the story about this fascinating find...not idle speculation or religious claims from some book or other. Empiricism in action, I like it:)

-Assume for a moment that the global flood theory was really on the table when trying to understand how these whales ended up a mile from the way to observe this would be of course be the scour marks discussed above, although MUCH fresher -- but this hypothesis would also entail that such scour marks be found ALL OVER THE WORLD, which is not the case. Therefore, the theory is dismissed instantly, rather than being taken seriously.