This is a brilliant case of turning on the light instead of exposing the darkness. Kirk never points out to Tim the erronous doctrines of Catholicism but rather explains the Gospel with clarity and Tim joins the dots. Click here to download the podcast and hear the encounter. It starts about four minutes into the program. Kirk teaches us that we can lead a horse to water, and while we can't make it drink, we can salt his oats.Tomorrow - Tim the Catholic Calls Back
Go On To Hear Tim's Phone Call When He Calls Back Two Weeks Later
15 comments:
The doctrines of the Holy Roman Catholic Church are not erroneous. Also check your spelling.
The origins of the Catholic Church is Jesus Christ. The origins of the Protestant sects are humans like Martin Luther, John Wesley and Henry VIII. I choose Jesus Christ.
And what "erroneous" doctrines would these be?
You and Kirk need to find a good catechist.
I couldn't agree more with my Catholic brethren above me. Christ founded one Church! Not 30,000 denominations. If the Catholic Church got it right, Kirk, with the exact same 27 New Testament books that you and Comfort acknowledge as Sacred Scripture, by deeming them canonical in the 4th century, then how did they get everything else wrong? These evangelicals have salvation, not in the fullness sense, but nevertheless, because of the connection, through the Sacred Scriptures, that belong to the Only Church that Christ established, the Catholic Church, whom is necessary for salvation.
Extra Ecclesiam nulla salus.
It is true that Christ established one church. However, if you read the book of Acts, you will find that the Catholic Church is nothing like what was established by the Holy Spirit. The Church changed during the time of Constantine, adopting practices of pagan Roman religions. I am NOT saying that all Catholics are pagan, but the original Biblical teaching have been perverted. Protestant religions developed as men were led by the Holy Spirit to make corrections in worship, to return to the original form of the Church. This is historically documented, as anyone can read if they take the time, and have an open mind.
BTW...the Catholic Church is NOT necessary for salvation. Only Jesus Christ is.
The Catholic Church is the first church created by Jesus Christ and his Apostles. No historian would ever deny this. Which leads me to my next point and listen very closely Jesus promised that this church he created and founded upon Peter would never fail not even the gates of hell would destroy this church. I believe in my Lord and his church has not failed like most protestants would want you to believe. The true church is the catholic church. To be a protestant you have to deny what Jesus tells his Apostles in Matthew 16:18!
Anonymous, to be a Protestant you have to interpret Matthew 16:18 correctly in the light of everything else the Bible says.
But to be a Catholic you have to deny what Ephesians 2:8-10 clearly says so that you can add works to the Gospel.
To be a Catholic you have to deny 1 Timothy 2:5 in order to make Mary a mediator between God and man.
To be a Catholic you have to deny the second commandment which forbids idolatry in order to pray to Mary.
To be a Catholic you have to deny Romans 3:23 in order to believe that Mary was not a sinner, and also the Pope.
To be a Catholic you have to deny Matthew 13:55 and Mark 6:3 in order to believe that Mary was always a virgin.
To be a Catholic you have to add books to the Bible in order to invent a the doctrine of purgatory and steal money from people.
To be a Catholic you have to deny Hebrews 7:23-25 to make the Pope into a priest.
To be a Catholic, you have to deny the entire book of Hebrews that clearly teaches that Jesus died once as a perfect payment for sin in order to believe that a Catholic priest calls Jesus down onto the cross again and again every time he celebrates mass.
To be a Christian you have to repent of your false religion and trust in the finished work of Jesus Christ ALONE to be saved from the wrath to come and receive the forgiveness of sins.
Cameron I'm sad to see your grasp of Christian doctrine is so far from the light.
Re: works see James 2:24 Ye see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only
Re: Mary as a Mediator. Jesus is the only mediator of redemption. Mary is a mediator who intercedes on our behalf.
Re: Mary idolatry. This is a Protestant misunderstanding. Am I committing idolatry when I ask my mom to pray for me? Of course not. Catholics simply ask Mary to intercede or pray for us. We don't pray to her.
Re:Mary and the Pope being sinless. Mary was born full of grace (Kecharitomene) as told in Luke 1:28, so that is true. Catholics do NOT believe the Pope is sinless. That is another misunderstanding perpetuated by Protestants. We believe the Pope is infallible on points of doctrine and morality under certain conditions.
Re: Mary's virginity. I have many brothers and sisters in the church. Yet I have no brothers and sisters. How can this be true? By not focusing on a literal understanding of brothers and sisters, as was intended in those verses.
Re: adding books to the bible. Catholics add books to the bible? That's rich. More like the Protestants remove books from the bible. And how exactly did you get your bible anyway? Oh yeah, from Catholics.
Re: Hebrews 7:23. Your argument doesn't make sense. However, I think you are wrong to deny that Jesus built his church upon the Rock who IS Peter, the first Pope.
Re: denying entire book of Hebrews. This is a blatant generalization. I accept the book of Hebrews, but I think it's a mistake to believe you only have to believe Jesus' grace is enough and then you can live whatever sinful life you want and think salvation is owed to you. Also, it's a pure shame that you deny Jesus more fully than you realize when you deny His presence in the Eucharist. Even Luther believed the Eucharist is the body, blood, soul and divinity of Christ.. So did all the church fathers.
Funny how Catholics believe protestants can still be saved even though they deny so much that Jesus taught as true. But Protestants don't believe that Catholics are saved until they "repent" of the religion that Christ himself established.
I'd suggest you learn Catholic traditions and teachings from Catholic sources rather than relying on what Protestants tell you we believe. I'd also suggest you challenge yourself and check out catholicscomehome.org If nothing else, I ask you to reconsider turning your back to Jesus evrytime you deny the Eucharist. Little do you understand how painful it is to Christ for you to deny His ultimate gift of himself.
Dear Anonymous, thank you for the honest affirmation of your heretical views.
In an age where those who would destroy human life, attack the dignity of marriage and otherwise assault the family are all over the news the net and the media, I have to run across someone attacking my Catholic beliefs and why? Because you don't believe in the Catholic church's teachings? Because you want to "save" me? Please understand. Those who seriously adhere to the teachings of the Catholic Church believe in the Triune god of the scripture, believe in Jesus Christ the only Son of God who died to redeem us and rose from the dead. We Catholics believe in those statements contained in the Apostles Creed and the Nicene Creed. For 1500 years the teachings of Christ's church were held by all of Christendom. In fact we consider all who believe that Jesus Christ to be the Son of God to be a part of the Church though separated because of human failing and error. But remember this, throughout history, it was the Catholic Church who held true to the teachings contained in the Scripture. Today - name one Christian denomination that stands clearly against divorce, abortion, homosexual marriage, and contraception. Only the Catholic Church remains firm in her commitment to follow the teachings of Christ. So please study your history. Understand the weakness of the human condition which explains the failures of those who were in leadership in the Church over the years and yet despite those failures the Truth that Jesus Christ is Lord is still proclaimed throughout the world. Be a part of the solution. Embrace the fullness of the Truth.
A big 10-4 to that. This nonsense about sola scriptura is nowhere in scripture. Ignorance is the basis for heretical Protestantism.
Sigh, another poorly catechised young man grasping at anti Catholic sources for his material. www.catholic.com check it out for the facts before you mock the Church established by Christ. You're in my prayers.
For 1500 hundred years the Bible remained the same. Then Martin Luther decided to start ripping out the books that didn't coincide with his "new doctrine". Seven OT books -- out. Maccabees 1& 2 because, guess what? it says "pray for the dead". That's why protestants can't find any Scripture for purgatory. It is referred to in NT but you need the OT for clarification. When Martin Luther started in on the NT books beginning with James, his fellow apostates hollered "foul" so he backed off. Maybe Kirk could call Catholic Answers and let a Catholic witness to him. Amazing what else he may learn.
No doubt he was able to do so because he was speaking to a poorly catechized Catholic who doesn't know the faith well enough. If it had been a well-informed Catholic, full of zeal for their ancient faith, I'm sure that Kirk would've heaped upon him, the various anti-Catholic's objections to Catholicism like it was going out of style.
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